Shiur summary (draft from the recording)
Shiurin d'oraisa: the shiva minim as measurements
שיעורין דאורייתא נינהו
Sukkah 5a · from line 42 · Wednesday, May 27, 2026
The sugya
The shiur goes through the Gemara's proof that shiurin are d'oraisa. Rav Chanin says the whole pasuk 'eretz chita u'se'orah...' was said for shiurin, and each of the seven species stands for a specific shiur: chita, se'orah, gefen, te'enah, rimon, zayis and devash. The Rebbi explains each shiur in practical terms. He ends by returning to the kasha on Rav's statement that shiurin are halacha l'Moshe miSinai, and previews the teirutz that they are halacha l'Moshe miSinai and the pasuk is only an asmachta.
Step by step (shakla v’tarya)
- GemaraLine 42: shiurin d'oraisa ninhu, from the pasuk eretz chita u'se'orah v'gefen u'te'enah v'rimon, eretz zayis shemen u'devash. Rav Chanin says the whole pasuk was said for shiurin.
- The RebbiThe pasuk tells you the shiurim have a source, and also that each of the seven species represents a particular shiur.
- ChazarahChita is for bayis hamenuga. The Rebbi said that yesterday he may have over-complicated it.
- MishnahA person enters a bayis hamenuga with his clothes on his shoulders and his sandals and rings in his hand. He and they are tamei immediately.
- MishnahIf he was wearing his clothes, with his sandals on his feet and rings on his fingers, he is tamei immediately. The items stay tahor until he lingers k'dei achilas pras: wheat bread (not barley bread), reclining, eaten with liftan (a dip).
- The RebbiEating always involves two measures: how much, and in how much time. That is why on Yom Kippur a pregnant woman is given a little at a time.
- The RebbiThe three conditions all speed up the shiur. Wheat is absorbed faster than barley. Reclining means undistracted, leisurely eating. A dip such as oil or salt makes the bread go down faster.
- GemaraLine 4, se'orah: a bone the size of a barley grain is metamei b'maga and b'masa, but not b'ohel.
- RashiRashi: to be metamei b'ohel you need much more, such as a full skull or most of the bones.
- The RebbiThe familiar k'zayis min hameis refers to flesh. Here we are dealing with a bone with no flesh on it, e.g. an old cemetery.
- GemaraLine 6, gefen: k'dei revi'is yayin l'nazir.
- RashiRashi: this refers to a nazir's issur on grape products (grape leaves, chartzanim and zagim), not just drinking wine. The shiur is the amount of grape product that displaces a revi'is of wine.
- KashaIf the shiur is displacement, why say revi'is yayin? Any liquid, even water, should do.
- TeirutzIt must be wine. Because of surface tension, a cup can hold a tiny bit more wine than water.
- Question from the chabura: why mention a nazir? Answer: only a nazir is forbidden grape products, so the measurement only applies to him.
- GemaraLine 7, te'enah: k'grogeres l'hotza'as Shabbos, the amount of a dried fig for carrying on Shabbos.
- GemaraRimon: d'tnan, klei baalei batim, shiuran k'rimonim.
- The RebbiA keili is mekabel tumah. The question is how big a hole ends its status as a keili. For a craftsman, any hole ruins it. A thrifty balabus keeps using it for bigger and bigger items until it cannot even hold pomegranates. Only then is it no longer a keili and no longer mekabel tumah.
- GemaraEretz zayis shemen: eretz shekol shiureha k'zeisim, i.e. all the remaining shiurim are a k'zayis.
- KashaLine 10: kol shiureha, salka daatach? Ha ika hani d'amrinan! All the shiurim are a k'zayis? We just listed others.
- TeirutzEla eima: rov shiureha k'zeisim. Apart from the special ones listed, the majority of shiurim are a k'zayis.
- GemaraDevash refers to dates: k'koseves hagasah b'Yom HaKippurim.
- The RebbiA large date, which he said means with its pit. Eating on Yom Kippur needs more than a k'zayis for the chiyuv kares, because you need a certain satiation, since the issur is to afflict yourself.
- Discussion of the word gasah. The Rebbi holds it simply means large (the date), not satiated.
- KashaBack to the kasha: all this shows that shiurin are d'oraisa, against the statement that they are halacha l'Moshe miSinai.
- TeirutzPreview of the teirutz (to be reviewed tomorrow): shiurin miktav ksivi? The pasuk never states the shiurim. Rather, they are halacha l'Moshe miSinai, and the pasuk is an asmachta b'alma.
- The RebbiAsmachta means to lean. The halacha l'Moshe miSinai found a pasuk to lean on and reference; it is a nice nod.
Kashas
- Gefen: if the shiur is the grape product that displaces a revi'is, why specify revi'is of wine and not just any liquid?
- How can the Gemara say all the shiurim are a k'zayis, when it just listed other shiurim?
- The pasuk shows shiurin are d'oraisa, so how can they be halacha l'Moshe miSinai?
Teirutzim
- Wine has surface tension, so a revi'is cup holds slightly more wine than water.
- Rov shiureha k'zeisim: most shiurim are a k'zayis, apart from the special ones listed.
- The shiurim are halacha l'Moshe miSinai, and the pasuk is only an asmachta b'alma.
Rashi & Tosafos
- Rashi: To be metamei b'ohel requires much more than a barley-sized bone, such as a full skull or most of the bones.
- Rashi: Revi'is yayin l'nazir refers to a nazir's issur on grape products. The shiur is the amount of grape product that displaces a revi'is of wine.
Mareh mekomos
- Pasuk: eretz chita u'se'orah... eretz zayis shemen u'devash. Rav Chanin says it was said for shiurin.
- Mishnah on entering a bayis hamenuga, as the source for the chita shiur (k'dei achilas pras).
- Shimshon's mother was told not to eat anything from the grape. Mentioned as in this week's haftarah, as a source for the nazir's issur on grape products.
- Mishnah in Keilim: klei baalei batim, shiuran k'rimonim.
The Rebbi’s chiddushim
- Eating halachically is always two measures: quantity and time. Hence a pregnant woman on Yom Kippur is fed a little at a time.
- The three conditions of k'dei achilas pras (wheat, reclining, with a dip) all speed up the eating, since wheat is absorbed faster, reclining means undistracted eating, and a dip helps it go down.
- Rimon: a craftsman's keili is ruined by any hole. A balabus keeps using his keili for larger items until it cannot hold pomegranates, and only then is it no longer a keili.
- Eating on Yom Kippur needs more than a k'zayis for kares, because it must remove the inuy and give some satiation.
- Asmachta means the halacha l'Moshe miSinai found a pasuk to lean on.
Unclear in recording
- He cites a source on why the three conditions of achilas pras speed up eating. The name of the source is unclear in recording.
- He lists examples of k'zayis shiurim (meis, neveilah, cheilev, pigul and others), apparently from a commentary. Who he attributes this to is unclear in recording.
- A remark that elsewhere revi'is yayin l'nazir may simply mean drinking a revi'is of wine, as opposed to here. Unclear in recording.
Drafted from the recording of the shiur, for chazarah. Torah terms follow the Rebbi’s own words; anything that could not be made out is marked “unclear in recording”. Tap a time to hear that point. Corrections welcome.